Biscuits wrote: What would different bullets bring me which the ELDMs don’t?
in2anity wrote:Biscuits wrote: What would different bullets bring me which the ELDMs don’t?
Quite simply, bullet consistency. Don't matter how high that value is, if the bullets aren't uniform, the group will suffer. Like i said, if you pay attention to the wind, you can shoot a better group, regardless of that "holy grail" BC value that every cool new shooter focuses so intently on. The best TR shooters, who are constantly watching the mirage and flags, are grouping into 1moa from the sling, with a humble 155.5gr 308 bullet. Those TR bullet's BC is only around 0.5... justsayin.
Are Hornady really that much worse in their uniformity? I don't know I've never measured them - but they are notably cheaper than the Bergers and Sierras. Where there's smoke there's generally fire
bladeracer wrote:
I'd rather use a bullet that's good enough that I know I can get more of when I need them than build an awesome load only to discover it's a two-year wait until I can get more of them. I'm still waiting on .303 174gn SMK's with no expected supply date known, glad I didn't bother doing load development with them.
Yep, wind read is far more important than knocking another quarter-minute off the group size.
If price dictated quality why aren't you using brass and copper bullets instead of jacketed lead? I've got a few TSX and TTSX bullets now in different calibres, but they're too expensive to sling them at the hillside outside of load development
I agree with Biscuits, the ELDM's work just fine, they're cheap, and they're generally readily available. If you're chasing trophies maybe spend some hours weight and ogive batching them.
SCJ429 wrote:A popular Queensland fun shop is advertising 174 gr SMK, I am surprised you cannot get them.
bladeracer wrote:
I'd rather use a bullet that's good enough that I know I can get more of when I need them than build an awesome load only to discover it's a two-year wait until I can get more of them. I'm still waiting on .303 174gn SMK's with no expected supply date known, glad I didn't bother doing load development with them.
Yep, wind read is far more important than knocking another quarter-minute off the group size.
If price dictated quality why aren't you using brass and copper bullets instead of jacketed lead? I've got a few TSX and TTSX bullets now in different calibres, but they're too expensive to sling them at the hillside outside of load development
I agree with Biscuits, the ELDM's work just fine, they're cheap, and they're generally readily available. If you're chasing trophies maybe spend some hours weight and ogive batching them.
Biscuits wrote:I bought that rifle to shoot a mile to 2 kilometres on variable terrain with uneven ground, uneven wind and no wind flags, so that is not the same as shooting groups in F-class at typically 1000 yards on a range with wind flags. A 308 is still supersonic at 1000 yards. The 300 PRC is supersonic at a mile with Hornady ELDMs. It would not be supersonic with Bergers.
Bryan Litz of Applied Ballistics has measured bullet to bullet BCs and Bergers are more consistent than Hornady, but not by much. A typical ELDM varies by a bit over 1% in measured, doppler radar verified BCs.
If the bullet has a high BC, which ELDMs do, it will have a shorter time of flight and be less affected by wind. I’m quite happy with a 1.8MoA group at a mile. Your group MoA (not just linear size) goes up with distance for any uncorrected wind variation so my 1.8 MoA at a mile is equivalent to 1 MoA at 1000 yards.
Plus at Bladeracer pointed out, you can actually go out and buy ELDMs rather than wait until next year for something theoretically better.
SCJ429 wrote:I know you are not loading and rely on factory offerings but for a person who appears to love the paper figures of the ELDM I am sure that you know that both Sierra and Berger both offer bullets that offer a better BC than what you are using. The 230 grain SMK and the Berger 245 Hybrid offer a better BC which give you a shorter flight time and buck the wind. The big plus is the consistency of their bullets. The great bit is you are having a go and enjoying some long range shooting. Good on you, cheers.
Biscuits wrote:Only Hornady makes 300 PRC factory ammo. Once I’ve burned through my 400 rounds of factory which I bought with the rifle, I’ll consider another bullet for reloading. But given the factory ammo is performing, I may end up just buying more factory.
If < MoA and low MV SD is coming out of factory ammo, I’d need another reason like more muzzle velocity to reload.
SCJ429 wrote:If it was $120 for a box of 20 then 400 rounds would cost $2,400. Makes my 300/378 seem positively economical.
SCJ429 wrote:If it was $120 for a box of 20 then 400 rounds would cost $2,400. Makes my 300/378 seem positively economical.