Sierra 135 ADI Factory Velocity in .308

[cusco]

Hi, just asking if any knows the velocity of the factory .308 ADI 135gn Sierra varminter factory load. I am just staring out to reload these projectiles for my .308 Howa and would like to reproduce close to the original velocity. Either that or any reloading data using AR 2208 for same 135 gn projectiles please. I cracked 2800 fps with 47 gn of 2208. 48gns were faster but primers showed some flatting. Any suggestions or load data, thanks.

[No1Mk3]

Hi, just asking if any knows the velocity of the factory .308 ADI 135gn Sierra varminter factory load. I am just staring out to reload these projectiles for my .308 Howa and would like to reproduce close to the original velocity. Either that or any reloading data using AR 2208 for same 135 gn projectiles please. I cracked 2800 fps with 47 gn of 2208. 48gns were faster but primers showed some flatting. Any suggestions or load data, thanks.

It is listed at 3000fps, in a specified test barrel under optimum climatic and laboratory conditions. You mileage may vary (considerably). Borrow a chrono and test it in your rifle, then load accordingly but remember ADI use powder batchings not neccesarily available to the reloader,

[cusco]

Thanks for info. I will try a few test loads around 47 gns at different seating depths.

[Over The Hill]

Here's some of my own test results for you.
Rifle, Ruger Scout, 18.5" barrel, 1:10, no muzzle bake or flash hider
Factory ADI Sierra Varminter 135g
1 2822
2 2830
3 2856
4 2835
5 2835
Average 2836
SD 12.6

My scout loved this ammo

Make of the results as you will, the short barrel on the scout is an obvious consideration when comparing results.

[Bello]

Hello Mate
I found that when I did load development with these projectiles, that my loads were slower than the pre-loaded ADI offerings. I think they use "Proprietary' powders.
If you aren't going to shoot lots of them, perhaps the pre-loaded stuff from ADI may save you a lot of stuffing around with load development.
I found the pre-loaded ADI 135gr were giving mw about an inch at 200 meters in my rifle. See pic below.

[cusco]

Thanks again for the info. The Ruger Scout results are similar to my 20 " Howa varmint barrel. I am happy to do some testing as I enjoy the reloading side of this shooting game. I have a stack of these same once fired cases to use plus several hundred projectiles to "play with". Reason for the 135 is to have something else for shooting light skinned game. My usual load is 150 Hornady SST which work great on pigs. This particular test rifle set up is my night hunter rig, a Howa 20" Varmint barrel in a MDT HNT26 stock fitted with my thermal scope, Pulsar Thermion2 Pro XP50 LRF. This has been my go to rig for night time fun. Hopefully will get some more tests done soon.
Thanks again for the replies.

[Jorlcrin]

Nick Harvey reviewed this ammo (135gn Varminter HP) in June 2016 in Sporting Shooter.

Rifle he used was a borrowed Savage Model 10, with a 610mm(24") heavy barrel.

It LOOKS like he chrono'd the ammo, but I cant see anything other than the factory blurb for results.
He did say he believed the powder to likely be AR2208, and that he found it excellent hunting ammo.

I've used about 900 of the 135gn ADI varmint HP's, and they are pretty good performers for hunting.
The ones I tried (Buffalo River 135gn Varminter HP- same thing) ran through a LabRadar chrono at 2945fps average MV in this rifle (RPR 20")
[Not found them quite as consistent/predictable as the 125SST in that rifles, but decent enough for most hunting.]

I load a Hornady 125gn SST pill for my Ruger Precision .308 [20" 1:10" twist].
I use 49.0 grains of AR2208, and while the primers are slightly flattened(warm load), my cases are lasting well over 5 reloads

I find the 125SST to work well for medium sized pigs at distance(over 200 m), and devastating on near anything closer than that.
The 125gn SST's have been chronoed through my RPR at 3051fps average MV.

Dont recall I've actually loaded any of the 135gn varmint HP pills yet, but the recipe I pulled out of a book somewhere suggested 47.5gns AR2208.
When I get around to loading them up, I'll likely start around 47gns and work up from there.

Obviously; this is what I've found in my setup - Your results will likely vary.
I wouldnt suggest you start with my loading(s), but hopefully it gives you somewhere to start.

[Billo]

Might be of use if you want to try another powder, I've been using 2219 behind a 140gr OEP BBT for 2940fps, accuracy is outstanding.

This is from a howa 20inch barrel

[cusco]

Hi Jorlcrin,
I too went through a can of these factory rounds, 480 odd from memory, so have plenty of brass and thanks very much for the velocity you got. I did not have a chronograph then. They did shoot well in both my heavy barrel Howa and sporter barrel Vanguard. As to reloading, I did a "ladder test" starting at 45 up to 48 gns of 2208 and got over 2800 fps at 47 gns. The 48 load started to show some flattening so have settled around 47 gns. I think this is fast enough for what I need.
Next step is to try some different seating depths when time permits.
Does any one have a factory round to measure overall length????
Thanks everyone input.

[Jorlcrin]

Hi Jorlcrin,
I too went through a can of these factory rounds, 480 odd from memory, so have plenty of brass and thanks very much for the velocity you got. I did not have a chronograph then. They did shoot well in both my heavy barrel Howa and sporter barrel Vanguard. As to reloading, I did a "ladder test" starting at 45 up to 48 gns of 2208 and got over 2800 fps at 47 gns. The 48 load started to show some flattening so have settled around 47 gns. I think this is fast enough for what I need.
Next step is to try some different seating depths when time permits.
Does any one have a factory round to measure overall length????
Thanks everyone input.

Cusco,

I dont have a 135HP Varminter factory round to measure for COAL, I'm afraid.
Thought I still had some, but seems they've all been used up.
But all a factory round will be, is short enough to fit into most actions, so likely much shorter than what is 'Best-Fit' for your rifle..

Ideally, you need to get a tool for measuring the distance to your Lands in your particular rifle.
Hornady make a decent enough one[Lock-N-Load Straight OAL Gauge], and a few people here have even made their own.
That way, you'd be able to measure ideal seating depth for your rifle to have them sitting just off the Lands, and go from there.

HOWEVER, note that the Sierra 135gn HP Varminter projectile is a short, stubby little thing, and measures just 0.896"
In comparison, the Sierra 135gn BTHP Match projectile is 1.074" in length.
Even the Hornady 125gn SST pills I've been loading, are 1.029" in length(They do have a polymer tip, though).

2 things that will likely limit your seating depth for that particular projectile:-
1). Your Magazine length - Most mags will only accept up to around 2.8" overall length of cartridge(COAL).
So unless you are running these single-shot, you'll have a problem (in most mag-fed rifles) if you exceed this length.
2). These are quite short projectiles, and you'll likely find that you cant seat them anywhere close enough to 2.800", before they arent being gripped well enough by the neck to stay seated.
[Likely the limiting factor for this projectile]

Likely teaching you to suck eggs here, but measuring the max cartridge OAL for your rifle, would be ideal, before making up anything longer than the standard 2.8".

The COAL limit I have in my reloading notes for this projectile, is a COAL of no more than 2.765".
Not sure where I got that figure from; suspect it was one of the many trawls I did of shooting forums some years back.
Given most of the 150/165 pills have a recommended COAL of 2.800", I expect the shorter length is due to that short projectile.
I also load my 125gn SST pills to 2.765" as well, whereas I load my 150gn SST pills to 2.800".
I also note that the ADI website has COAL shoter than 2.8" for most of the projectiles below 150gn.

Sorry; Hope this is of some help.

[cusco]

Hi, Thanks for reply. I do have a Hornady OAL Gauge so have measured the length where it just touches the lands. I was going to do a small batch seating at different OALs to see what groups better. As to mags I use MDT steel for Howa and polymer for Vanguard which I have measured the internal OAL length so will work within those parameters. It was more of a interest point to know the factory OAL as they did shoot well in both rifles. Thanks for suggestions. Just need time to do it! Cheers.

[cusco]

Hi folks, well finally got to the range to test the 3 batches at different OALs. 2.750, 2.700, 2.650 Winner was 2.750 with a 3 shot group of just on 20mm at 100 mts with 2 shots touching. The other 2 groups were @ 50 mm. Sorry no pic as I can't work out how to post image. DOH !!!
Happy with that as I was using the thermal scope not a day optic so can't complain. Will load up a few of these now and hopefully get to try them on something other than paper.
Thank you to all who gave advice and suggestions.
Cheers Cusco.

[Wapiti]

Good stuff Cusco. You will find the 135gn Sierra varminter projectiles pretty good for all round use, but just keep in mind that they are true "varmint" bullets in that they are very expansive, they do so very violently.
Comparing them to 125gn Ballistic Tips for example, they are noticeably more destructive.

FYI, they do a 150gn projectile the same, it is just a little longer in the base. These are still quite violently expanding bullets, but the extra weight and slightly slower velocity see them expanding more consistently if used for hunting.

I have used 1500 plus of these 135gn bullets in my handloading, and am on the second 500rd tin of the ADI factory cartridges with these projectiles loaded. My tins are the ADI branded one, not the Buffalo River. I am led to believe they are the same.
We also have and use interchangeably, the Winchester USA "white box" factory load of these Sierra 135gn projectiles. The powder/primer used in these will be completely different, but in all my rifles these shoot exactly the same, which is interesting.

I went to a bit of trouble as a project to work out what powder they used, and from my chronying, I got identical POI and group sizes, (in fact better), with AR2206H.
I tried AR8208 (not acceptable) and AR2208 as well. 2208 gave the highest velocities, but 2206H gave the best results on paper, i.e. the smallest groups. In my rifles, mind.
These are favoured loads in a few 308 bolt actions, pump actions and a semi-auto. I use them virtually every day as a go-to ammo.

The velocities in a 16" barrel are avg at 2850fps with 45gn/2206H, 3045fps in 20" barrel bolt actions and 3110fps avg. in a 24" varmint rifle.
From reading other posts, these figures are quite good. I use a Garmin Chrony.

Seating depth - because these projectiles are so short, I just seat them in the neck for a full diameter of grip area. Buggering about with COAL dimensions/off the lands for ammo used quickly from a magazine, or especially from a semi-auto ramming them in, is last on the list, first priority in the field is a good grip on the bullet. I also crimp every cartridge I load with these bullets for this reason - reliability.
But the main thing is the best groups, not another 50fps velocity, because these are varmint bullets and aren't the best for chest shooting from my experiences.

I would put them a little less fragile that the 125 and 130gn hollowpoints from Speer etc, but still, shot placement is a big deal using these once you step up to larger animals. So I use them for head shooting everything, from culling animals to even deer for meat. Pigs and fallow deer I always shoot at the top of the neck skull/spine joint if I can.

But yeah, if you want to match the factory velocity and POA, and a better result in group precision, I found in my rifles across a big variation in action types that 2206H was what I found. You may find different.

[Wapiti]

SGK1.jpg (679.25 KiB) Viewed 6195 times

A few pics to colour the place up a bit.
As you can see, we are fans of these projectiles for what we need them for.

[cusco]

Hi Wapiti,
Thanks for the reply. I too reload the 150 gn version of these but mainly for use in the Rem 7600 pump using multi fired PPU cases ( fire forgets). This is my close range pig gun for chasing pigs in the buggy or quad. Yes they expand well as some wounds look savage! But still drops the pigs. Main reason for the 135 was something more explosive for dogs, foxes etc at longer ranges than my usual 150 SST . As this particular rifle is my "night hunter" rig fitted with a thermal scope I wanted to take advantage of the scope having multiple zeros, hence the different loads. Hornady SST 150 for pigs/deer and now the 135 Sierras for lighter game. Next project is to load some of the Hornady 190 Sub X at slow super speeds (low 2000 fps) for the 308. I use these 190s in my 300 Blackout at subsonic speeds which work OK but I thought it might be worth trying them out going a bit faster. I have thought of trying different powder but was happy with the results using 2208 which I have plenty of.
Thanks again for your input.

[Wapiti]

You do exactly what I do, saving all the old brass for the 7600 and similar.

One thing that I found was, that if your loads aren't zipping along so quickly, you will get a bit more penetration.
I used to work on the quickest loads then play with the usual things to refine the accuracy, like seating depth (limited in the 135's because of shortness) but now I'm only looking for inherently accurate combinations, and forget the speed.
Of course I chrony everything, particularly loads for longer range stuff to allow for drop, but that doesn't count as importance inn hunting loads. It is interesting to use as comparison to results gotten though, and part of finding consistency.
Then, things like mixing brands of cases, primers etc don't have any effect on zero or groups, at least with consistent rifles.
The lower speeds like what I get from the 16" barrels actually are more flexible and give more penetration. But you're onto it so good luck mate.