Breathing

[MG5150]

Hi All

I've read and been told conflicting advice on breathing.

Do you squeeze the trigger on the exhale?

Or hold your breath and fire when ready?

Or is it unique to every individual and you just need to find out what works for you?

[No1Mk3]

it is a very subjective issue, with most people (including some long range champions) telling you to pause at the end of exhalation and take your shot. There are some who will tell you to hold at the top of inhalation and take your shot, including in my case 2 AASAM champions. Others maintain that there is a natural breathing point when your reticle will settle on your desired aim point and you should learn to hold your breath at that point. Whatever you do, don't hold your breath for more than a few seconds, continue breathing then try again. Our club champion also counts his heartbeats and shoots when he feels his heart is most settled, way beyond my understanding.

[Wapiti]

Never really thought about it. Your body will tell you what works if you try a few things, like No1Mk3 spoke about.

So I did think about it, and I actually breathe normally and exhale and take the shot when my lungs are empty. So I break the shot before I take another breath. There is no way I could breathe and shoot accurately.
Your diaphragm moves in, out, up, down and that's never gonna work.

On the heartbeat thing... It doesn't affect me and I don't feel it. When laying in certain aspects prone, it could make itself felt from memory. But it's a matter of positioning yourself so the effect isn't felt.
If you're an excitable person, maybe have HBP or a fast pulse, I suppose it could be an issue.

[Tinker]

Unless you're shooting with a front and rear support for your rifle, your barrel will move downwards when you inhale then upwards as you exhale.
For me it feels natural to fire as my sight picture comes up onto the target when I breathe out.

[mchughcb]

Hi All

I've read and been told conflicting advice on breathing.

Do you squeeze the trigger on the exhale?

Or hold your breath and fire when ready?

Or is it unique to every individual and you just need to find out what works for you?

Why do you ask? If you aren't shooting benchrest competition it makes zero practical difference when hunting.

[Blr243]

I can’t shoot very well at all. The best 3,shot group I ever did was 17 mm at 100 with a scoped browning lever 243. My reticle wobbles allover the place ( bench with front and rear bags ) It’s never steady I see other people shooting clover leaf groups Is there anyone else as bad as me ? I tried shooting between breaths.

[Wapiti]

Why do you ask? If you aren't shooting benchrest competition it makes zero practical difference when hunting.

Surprised you asked that mate, he asks because ignoring your breathing can make a huge difference.
It's not just benchrest comps, it's ensuring your bullet goes exactly where you want it, whether you're sighting in a rifle, testing loads for your rifle, or don't want to blow the jaw off an animal in the bush because you are wobbling all over the place from walking all morning.

[Wapiti]

I can’t shoot very well at all. The best 3,shot group I ever did was 17 mm at 100 with a scoped browning lever 243. My reticle wobbles allover the place ( bench with front and rear bags ) It’s never steady I see other people shooting clover leaf groups Is there anyone else as bad as me ? I tried shooting between breaths.

If you can get a group like that mate from a BLR, with all the things against you in the design of that rifle then you aren't doing anything wrong! And the rifle is a keeper too.

[straightshooter]

Hi All

I've read and been told conflicting advice on breathing.

Do you squeeze the trigger on the exhale?

Or hold your breath and fire when ready?

Or is it unique to every individual and you just need to find out what works for you?

It would have helped the conversation if you had provided some context to your question as each form of shooting will elicit a different answer.
For example prone smallbore and fullbore vs. benchrest vs. offhand field shooting demand different techniques where breath control may play an important or negligible role.

[Fester]

Did you do the basics by starting with a .22lr and shooting heaps of rounds for the first year?
That's how I developed a great start to rifle marksmanship.

TBH, I rarely focus or think much about breathing. More just on basics like rifle setup and how I hold it steady with body and head position.
Hand is important, as you have to let that trigger off with no movement.

When doing all the .22lr practice, before getting a .223 to work up with cenetfires, it was all about keeping those crosshairs on the bull.
When the aim is at a pinpoint with no movement, and good follow-through, you can start shooting single ragged holes with good target ammo.
In the right light conditions, I could see the holes printing, and when using CCI std, I would see the 5th shot fly from the single ragged hole when it was not me, just the std flyer that CCI ammo would throw in. I had to go to SK ammo for the group shooting.

I find I shoot at my best when I deliberately slow everything down and take each shot very slowly.

[mchughcb]

Why do you ask? If you aren't shooting benchrest competition it makes zero practical difference when hunting.

Surprised you asked that mate, he asks because ignoring your breathing can make a huge difference.
It's not just benchrest comps, it's ensuring your bullet goes exactly where you want it, whether you're sighting in a rifle, testing loads for your rifle, or don't want to blow the jaw off an animal in the bush because you are wobbling all over the place from walking all morning.

There is no context to his question. I've shot benchrest 22LR with 36X scope abs I can see tge movement with my heart rate. I shoot 500NE where I couldn't give a poop about breathing or trigger squeezing. Get a shot off in the field offhand in under 2 seconds, sight picture and lead is way more important. If I'm bombing a mob of pigs I don't have time for breathing or squeezing.

[Wapiti]

I dont think his question has no context, maybe a newby just needs to be asked for some more info.

Some of us are mere mortals, not supermen. And we all started somewhere.



Fuc**n predictive text

[MG5150]

Did you do the basics by starting with a .22lr and shooting heaps of rounds for the first year?
That's how I developed a great start to rifle marksmanship.

I did 50 shots at the SSAA range every week for a quarter of a year before applying for my license, then went straight to a 30-06 for deer hunting. I didn't have any coaching, didn't understand groupings or what I was doing, just aimed at the bullseye and squeezed the trigger. It wasn't until after I got more into the hobby I started trying to improve my accuracy and shooting technique.

For context, most of my shooting is deer hunting, or thermal fox hunting from a tripod, but when it comes to sighting in I'm on a bench with bipods and backrest, and I'll be trying to be as accurate as possible when zeroing.

Why do you ask? If you aren't shooting benchrest competition it makes zero practical difference when hunting.

Might not make much of a difference on a Sambar under 100m but I've missed a dozen foxes by a whisker and maybe my breathing was the difference? Doesn't hurt to ask. (I watched your big long driven fox hunt compilation last night, awesome stuff!)

[womble]

Shotgun is also another answer.

[mchughcb]

Did you do the basics by starting with a .22lr and shooting heaps of rounds for the first year?
That's how I developed a great start to rifle marksmanship.

I did 50 shots at the SSAA range every week for a quarter of a year before applying for my license, then went straight to a 30-06 for deer hunting. I didn't have any coaching, didn't understand groupings or what I was doing, just aimed at the bullseye and squeezed the trigger. It wasn't until after I got more into the hobby I started trying to improve my accuracy and shooting technique.

For context, most of my shooting is deer hunting, or thermal fox hunting from a tripod, but when it comes to sighting in I'm on a bench with bipods and backrest, and I'll be trying to be as accurate as possible when zeroing.

Why do you ask? If you aren't shooting benchrest competition it makes zero practical difference when hunting.

Might not make much of a difference on a Sambar under 100m but I've missed a dozen foxes by a whisker and maybe my breathing was the difference? Doesn't hurt to ask. (I watched your big long driven fox hunt compilation last night, awesome stuff!)

Are you sure you missed? If you are shooting off a bipod or tripod, the room for error by breathing on fox size targets is not much. There coud be other things at play. Like your hold,the wind, grass, elevation, fox moves while refresh rate is 30-50Hz. List goes on.

[fnq22]

Hi mate ..I started a new disclipine for me when I got a Handgun licence and my first pistol at the beginning of the year..

Although i actually started shooting 45 years back with a slug gun at age 12 and a 22 2 years later, this year has been the most fun since that inital rush of a first gun as a kid..

The point I'm trying to make is that the question you asked suggests that the answer for you might be to look into a dryfire training program...

Despite only being very much a newby in the handgun game I have entered a few club Service pistol matchs and last match came 1st out of 13 other rimfire competitors (including several RO's, a cop and some guys that have been shooting for decades) and 2nd overall including centrefire, just pipped by 2 points by a dude using a red dot on a on a fully setup Cz ts2 9mm ISPC race gun...

So obviously I must be a special talent based on that result...well unfortunately thats just not true and will never be ..I'm just an average guy that just doesnt take on a new hobby"just for fun"..I dont see the point in putting the time, effort and money into something unless I do the work to see an improvement..Then I "enjoy" seeing the reults of my hard work..

But when i have entered some local ISPC matchs and struggled to get the hang of practical pistol shooting a guy suggested I try Dryfire training..
Holy cow..!...Once I started googling and seeing why top competative shooters in both practical shooting Handgun and Rifle were as good as they were it just sunk in...It really was a lightbulb moment..

There may be just a few exceptions but most became good shooters simply by practise and training and as most of us might only get to the range or out in the bush once a week or maybe once a month its just not enough to quickly develop the skills necessary to be a good shooter..

Doing 15-30 minutes 3-4 times a week on the fundamentals neccessary to shooting is guaranteed to get you to the point where all the things like breathing, trigger control, stance, grip or mounting the gun will become 2nd nature through development of muscle memory...

Dont just go through the motions though because its important to be very self analytical in everything you do and then practise those things during occasional lessons to give confirmation that what you are learning translates into your actual shooting and then work on your deficiencies.....I often use a shot timer for speed and to better gauge whether I'm getting better, faster etc...I even sometimes record myself on the phone doing various drills to be able to better analyse what I am doing and make improvements..

Seriously do some googling and jump on youtube and see how the good shooters do it and try it for a month or 2 ....its just as applicable to rifles as it is to handguns...and as a hunter it will give you much greater confidence to take that shot knowing where you are going to hit before the bullet even hits your target..

Like me when people taking it seriously start seeing outstanding results it becomes a bit addictive but very annoying for the wife to see all manner of targets stuck on the walls all around the house..I even set up stages around my yard for ISPC practical training...

[Fester]

I asked that question as you see it all the time, What first rifle should I get, .308 or 30-06?
My answer is, everyone needs a .22lr, so you may as well start with that.

Some blokes are naturals and will get by, but lots will develop bad stuff like flinching or other stuff that will hinder good marksmanship skills.
The only way I know, is start small with no or little recoil and build up.

I am completely self tought in my shooting and deer hunting, it's all part of the journey, and how I like the challenge.
I do like shooting, so shoot clays and longer ranges, open sights as it's all part of it.
I still shoot the rimfires and sluggy as I just shoot everything, even a bow.

I did a lot of range shooting with my .223 as it could shoot groups without getting hot and fairly heavy for a sporter, cheap shooting as well, and that helps.

You coul try just screwing a scope, big enough to see holes at 100 onto the fox rifle.
A couple of range shoots will tell you if you have issues or not.

Slow 5 shot groups will show what's going on and a short barrel cool off to keep that out of the equasion.

[MG5150]

[/quote]

Are you sure you missed? If you are shooting off a bipod or tripod, the room for error by breathing on fox size targets is not much. There coud be other things at play. Like your hold,the wind, grass, elevation, fox moves while refresh rate is 30-50Hz. List goes on.[/quote]

First trip to the chicken farm we had plenty come out but were trying to spotlight them with 22LR at 70m-100m and managed to get 3

Second trip we used the 223 with thermal clip on and managed to get 8

Third trip we got another 7

Fourth trip we both missed a combined total of 12 foxes left very frustrated...

I put it down to the thermal clip on not holding zero properly as it was quite a few inches out when I checked it the next week, but also amplified by my inexperience...

I'm sure 12 months down the track I'll be a much better shooter, and a few more years even better still. I'm still new to everything but enthusiastic to learn and look for any area I can improve.

I'm about to watch your shotgun video.

[MG5150]

Are you sure you missed? If you are shooting off a bipod or tripod, the room for error by breathing on fox size targets is not much. There coud be other things at play. Like your hold,the wind, grass, elevation, fox moves while refresh rate is 30-50Hz. List goes on.

First trip to the chicken farm we had plenty come out but were trying to spotlight them with 22LR at 70m-100m and managed to get 3

Second trip we used the 223 with thermal clip on and managed to get 8

Third trip we got another 7

Fourth trip we both missed a combined total of 12 foxes left very frustrated...

I put it down to the thermal clip on not holding zero properly as it was quite a few inches out when I checked it the next week, but also amplified by my inexperience...

I'm sure 12 months down the track I'll be a much better shooter, and a few more years even better still. I'm still new to everything but enthusiastic to learn and look for any area I can improve.

I'm about to watch your shotgun video.

[MG5150]

Doing 15-30 minutes 3-4 times a week on the fundamentals neccessary to shooting is guaranteed to get you to the point where all the things like breathing, trigger control, stance, grip or mounting the gun will become 2nd nature through development of muscle memory...

Dont just go through the motions though because its important to be very self analytical in everything you do and then practise those things during occasional lessons to give confirmation that what you are learning translates into your actual shooting and then work on your deficiencies.....I often use a shot timer for speed and to better gauge whether I'm getting better, faster etc...I even sometimes record myself on the phone doing various drills to be able to better analyse what I am doing and make improvements..

Seriously do some googling and jump on youtube and see how the good shooters do it and try it for a month or 2 ....its just as applicable to rifles as it is to handguns...and as a hunter it will give you much greater confidence to take that shot knowing where you are going to hit before the bullet even hits your target..

Like me when people taking it seriously start seeing outstanding results it becomes a bit addictive but very annoying for the wife to see all manner of targets stuck on the walls all around the house..I even set up stages around my yard for ISPC practical training...

Thanks for such a detailed reply. I've got some snap caps and will get back to dry fire drills as I've let it slip the last few months. I developed a flinch early on and was able to train it out with dry firing and wearing double hearing protection when range shooting.

In addition to targets around the house, I like to put on 'wild deer footage' on Youtube and take shots at the deer on screen.

[mchughcb]

Well if the clip on thermal isn't aligned and is off by quite a few inches that will explain it. I've had scope mounts come loose a few times that had me scratching my head why I was shooting so bad. Tightened them up and all of a sudden I hit what I'm aiming at.


Shooting foxes with 22LR at 70-100m is probably going to result in a few run off's. You may or may not hear the thud of a hit but the animal may run like it hadn't been hit.

[MG5150]

Well if the clip on thermal isn't aligned and is off by quite a few inches that will explain it. I've had scope mounts come loose a few times that had me scratching my head why I was shooting so bad. Tightened them up and all of a sudden I hit what I'm aiming at.


Shooting foxes with 22LR at 70-100m is probably going to result in a few run off's. You may or may not hear the thud of a hit but the animal may run like it hadn't been hit.

Yeah it wasn't ideal. There were some big hay bales about 60m from the carcass pile and we set up on them. My mate who took me there didn't want to use the .223 because he was worried that once we fired a shot we'd spook every fox from the area. Once we'd shot one with it and another one came trotting along less than 3 minutes later, we ditched the 22LR and started using the 223 exclusively.