New air-rifle perhaps?

[JDM9691]

Well I said I couldn't be stuffed doing ballistics tests, but of course I did , and it gave some interesting results.
After looking on youtube, I dug up some clay out of the paddock, wet and mixed it up, then shaped it into a block.
I took a couple .22 JSB 15.9gr Exact jumbos and made them into hollow points with a sharpened nail, and fired them and the standard pellet, at 25m into the clay block at the HIGH (=915 FPS *) and LOW (=590 fps *) settings on the Dreamline. (* Estimated MV, not measured)

Clay Block

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I sliced the clay open, did some measuring and dug out the pellets.

Results

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My conclusions are that : -
1. Hollow points are not worth using at low speeds, but do get decent expansion in the HIGH setting.
2. The LOW setting doesn't get much expansion at all.
2. The lowest penetration of wet clay was 85mm, so it's no surprise they will all go through pigeons depending on which part they hit
3. Hollow points in HIGH gave the same penetration as non hp in LOW. Will be trying more of these outdoor for sure.
4. Making your own hollow points is pretty easy. Wouldn't want to do 500 though!

I still reckon it might be worth getting a .177 barrel for this thing and try some light hollow points. Would be interesting to do this test again.
I'm usually a centrefire guy, but I'm really enjoying shooting the PCP, and it's a lot cheaper than the .243!

[Wapiti]

Great concise testing mate, and really appreciate the effort and help.

So by the looks, worrying about hollow-point availability is not really a thing for me, because the birds making such a mess and real human health hazard are tiny things.
Accuracy is no.1 and also is overpenetration. I really don't care about tiny dents 6m above the ground, can't see them.

[Damo300]

G'day mate.
If you're in SE QLD, you're more than welcome to borrow my 177 for a bit.
It's a cheap 80s Chinese shanghai model. Nothing special. Open sight, very accurate, side lever loading.

Doesn't go through coro iron, but it knocks rats, pigeons and mynors no worries.

Thanks a heap Damo. That's a really thoughtful offer.
Thing is, I'd probably want to keep the thing!
Problem is, right now the birds are not around, as they are migratory and have decided to move wherever else it is that they feel like going, but they'll be back.
My dad bought a Shanghai 177 from Struddies' Sports Store in the Sunnybank Kmart shopping centre when we were kids, and we used to go out on picnics with the family and shoot at cans in the bush near home. I remember it fondly, because it got the family together and was quite accurate with the old Diabolo and Wasp pellets we could buy at the hardware shop.
Imagine the puddles of wee and runny bum juice if someone dared do that now.

All good mate.
I reckon that's the kind of air rifle you're after.
Nice weakened spring, that won't penotrate the iron.


I remember struddies.

I got mine at the opening of sportsfair at Capalaba Park shopping Center in 88.
My old man got a new under and over at the same time.
Loved those days!
"I'll have that gun, that gun, those mags, 10 boxes of those rounds, and this lovely looking crossbow please".
Pay for your items, then walk out into a Shopping Center full of families, no gun bags, just the box they come in, and a bag full of rounds etc.
Noone batted an eyelid.



I remember the old diablo pellets, and the Wasp, or Sting pellets?
I remember them as Sting with the picture of the wasp trying to sting, however I have had a few Mandela effects happen of late so, not sure if that's the start of alsymers, or I'm just an imaginative kind of person, or I really have slipped into an alternate dimension.. Im thinking the latter with all of the weird things going on today.


I reckon your after a cheap gamo zombie, or something similar to mine.
You can't fit a scope to mine without gunsmithing mounts to the action, or air resevior, so perhaps the newer ones may be of benifit if you want a scope.
Personally, I prefer open sights in sheds and tighter areas, unless it's a 1 to 5 or something.

Have you got a PTA in yet?
That's a pain in the rear to do for slug guns as well.
Got to wait the cooling off period for your new 177, even though you have a few rifles in the safe already.

[Flyonline]

Great concise testing mate, and really appreciate the effort and help.

So by the looks, worrying about hollow-point availability is not really a thing for me, because the birds making such a mess and real human health hazard are tiny things.
Accuracy is no.1 and also is overpenetration. I really don't care about tiny dents 6m above the ground, can't see them.

Do you have anything now? I can send a handful of either/both .177 (crow magnum) and .22 (hunter extreme) hollow points if you'd like to try them.

I also have some hollow point slugs which would be fine at short ranges, but they appear to need decent speed to open up properly.

[Fester]

The brand with the German sounding name starting with W, that I have NFI how to spell is the tool for you.
A quality, accurate springer that comes in different powered models.
HW60, 70 etc.
The lowest power model bought new will likely be the cheapest, and serve you for life.
Blokes in the know tune them using kits to make them smoother and better, but I wouldn't bother until it needs seals or whatnot.

PCPs are exy when you add the filling equipment and tend to be for the tinkerer, with o-rings, and tuning.

I did some home made ballistic gell and tested those hunting Hades 16gr .22 pellets against the standard dome head JSB pellets.
I knew they still shot well at 50m, but wow, what a difference.
The standard domes penetrated about 8" and near exited the gel, not deforming at all.
The Hades penetrated about 2" and turned into a flat disk.
I am not sure if it's a bit much, and never tested them on critters; they may well put less holes in the shed.

[NTSOG]

Fester I believe you were referring to the German Weihrauch brand of air rifles of which I have a number: HW 80, HW 90 and so on. They have excellent triggers. Weihrauch also makes centre fire and rimfire rifles of quality.

Confusion often occurs when people are referring to Weihrauch rifles because in German W is pronounced as V, hence the name is pronounced Virauch.

[Wapiti]

Thanks for all the info yet again, no I was going to put in a PTA but with all the fuss over different states and gun laws, I hadn't.
But a mild powered springer is what I'll go for.
I might need to go to Toowoomba.

Struddies was in the Kmart shopping centre at Sunnybank, was a huge deal because it was the first of it's type in the Brisbane Southside, so you'd feel big and important as a kid going there.
KMart had the post-'60's push feed Model 70's in 243, 308, I remember a Rem 788 in .222, there was the Bentley pumps, both 8-shot Riot types and 28" versions, even Winchester 1200 pump guns, and semi-autos. And the "slug guns".
5mins walk into the mall and there was Strudwick's Sports, with similar gear.
Then, down at Underwood, a gruelling hour pushy ride down the Beenleigh Rd hill, was A-Mart Allsports, they had everything, even X-mil FN59's, M1 carbines, K98's, 30-06 Garands. And all the powder, primers, a bench of presses and scales.
WTF happened to the joint.

[bladeracer]

Fester I believe you were referring to the German Weihrauch brand of air rifles of which I have a number: HW 80, HW 90 and so on. They have excellent triggers. Weihrauch also makes centre fire and rimfire rifles of quality.

Confusion often occurs when people are referring to Weihrauch rifles because in German W is pronounced as V, hence the name is pronounced Virauch.

And the ei is pronounced aye, the au is pronounced ow and ch is pronounced k but with a guttural h stuck on the end of it.

I will never get used to Walhalla here being pronounced with a W

[bladeracer]

KMart had the post-'60's push feed Model 70's in 243, 308, I remember a Rem 788 in .222, there was the Bentley pumps, both 8-shot Riot types and 28" versions, even Winchester 1200 pump guns, and semi-autos. And the "slug guns".

My first centrefire was the 788 in .222Rem, and my first gun was the Bentley riot gun 8-shot 20" with rifle sights. Both were awesome.

[JDM9691]

Personally, I prefer open sights in sheds and tighter areas, unless it's a 1 to 5 or something.

Sadly, open sights are unworkable with my eyes - regardless of which glasses I have on, only one of the front, rear sight, and target will be in focus at a time I know it's a huge expense on an air rifle, but I have a Hikmicro Alpex which gets swapped around a lot. It's perfect for pigeons in sheds at night. On a nice dark night and you can pick them off one after the other and none get away, but as soon as you put a torch on, they fly off. In daylight I get one shot and the rest are gone. The results with nightvision gear are way beyond what you would dream of with open sights and a torch, but is not for everyone because it doesn't come cheap.

[NTSOG]

Bladeracer: "And the ei is pronounced aye".

However, ie in a German word is pronounced e. Then we could talk about Germanic word order which back to front is by our English usage, e.g. a boy doesn't sit in a tree. Instead, he is the "on the tree sitting boy."

[Fester]

I knew someone would come up with the name, Krouts sure do talk funny, and I haven't even went OS to Tassie.

They are a quality rifle for sure, and heard about the triggers.
A Diana or something may be cheaper, but won't be quite like a Weihrauch.
The airhead gurus that work on them always seemed to recommend them.
They were not bad value, back when I started about 11 years back.

I had one of those plastic toys, the Crosman 1077 revolver action with the worst trigger ever.
I swore that I will just give it in to a police station when I could no longer fix it myself, which I did.
If you didn't put a fresh gas canister in it before shooting an Indian Myna, it often bounced off the bird, and that was sneaky shots out from behind the door at a few meters.

The lower power one may have been the HW 60, not sure if the stocks are full size, or smaller for kids.

[bladeracer]

Bladeracer: "And the ei is pronounced aye".

However, ie in a German word is pronounced e. Then we could talk about Germanic word order which back to front is by our English usage, e.g. a boy doesn't sit in a tree. Instead, he is the "on the tree sitting boy."

The ei and ie are a real pain for us as sometimes we pronounce ei as ee and sometimes as aye, and we do the same with ie, very annoying

A mate has a German surname and is always ready to jump on you for pronouncing it wrong, I guess he's been getting it his whole life

[bladeracer]

I knew someone would come up with the name, Krouts sure do talk funny, and I haven't even went OS to Tassie.

They are a quality rifle for sure, and heard about the triggers.
A Diana or something may be cheaper, but won't be quite like a Weihrauch.
The airhead gurus that work on them always seemed to recommend them.
They were not bad value, back when I started about 11 years back.

I had one of those plastic toys, the Crosman 1077 revolver action with the worst trigger ever.
I swore that I will just give it in to a police station when I could no longer fix it myself, which I did.
If you didn't put a fresh gas canister in it before shooting an Indian Myna, it often bounced off the bird, and that was sneaky shots out from behind the door at a few meters.

The lower power one may have been the HW 60, not sure if the stocks are full size, or smaller for kids.

Pretty sure my Ruger 10/22 .177" is based on the 1077 revolver-action.

[NTSOG]

HW 80 is a good adult spring air rifle and has been around for years. The HW 90s also sold as Beeman RX1 have a Theoben gas ram which can be adjusted for huge power, though they can be really tough to cock. They are heavy rifles due to their power output. I have two in .20 calibre. They are an older model rifle. Have a look at the website below for some beautiful air rifles.

https://www.airgunnation.com/threads/th ... d.1194383/

[Blr243]

N T sog , are u still slamming lots of foxes ?

[NTSOG]

G'day Blr243,

Foxes are a bit thin on the ground around my property and neighbouring properties at the moment. It appears I have been quite effective to the point that after 5 years or so of culling I hardly see a live one to shoot and my trail cameras aren't catching anything but scores of 'roos. We killed a beast for the freezer 4 weeks ago and I dumped the offal and skin out in a paddock with a camera set up to record expected 'visitors'. The result was a single picture of one fox at 1:40 AM after 8 days! It makes sense that if the adult/breeding age foxes are knocked off season after season the numbers must drop. I did get two baby foxes just after Christmas with the .22 magnum, but that's it.

[Blr243]

Well done mate on hitting them so hard that you got them well under control

[Wapiti]

HW 80 is a good adult spring air rifle and has been around for years. The HW 90s also sold as Beeman RX1 have a Theoben gas ram which can be adjusted for huge power, though they can be really tough to cock. They are heavy rifles due to their power output. I have two in .20 calibre. They are an older model rifle. Have a look at the website below for some beautiful air rifles.

https://www.airgunnation.com/threads/th ... d.1194383/

Thanks NTSOG

[Damo300]

Personally, I prefer open sights in sheds and tighter areas, unless it's a 1 to 5 or something.

Sadly, open sights are unworkable with my eyes - regardless of which glasses I have on, only one of the front, rear sight, and target will be in focus at a time I know it's a huge expense on an air rifle, but I have a Hikmicro Alpex which gets swapped around a lot. It's perfect for pigeons in sheds at night. On a nice dark night and you can pick them off one after the other and none get away, but as soon as you put a torch on, they fly off. In daylight I get one shot and the rest are gone. The results with nightvision gear are way beyond what you would dream of with open sights and a torch, but is not for everyone because it doesn't come cheap.

"It doesn't come cheap".
This is the reason I haven't purchased one yet.
I want the Bugatti, not the kia.

I borrowed a cheaper thermal off a friend a while back and I did not like it at all.
I cannot recall the brand, but there is no way I'd buy one.
I did not like the picture. Tried all modes.
Chewed the batteries.
Tried all the settings to limit battery drain to no avail.
Hard to see in just the slightest of rain, and forget it in any fog at all. I thought it was broken haha.
The heat signals were not destinguished.
An ant mound looked like a wombat, which looked like a rock, and if an animal was in front of the rock, it disappeared.
Target ID wasn't impossible, but I wasn't sure on a few occasions.
However, it was an older one worth well over 2k, but that's the kia of the selection.

Then you see the contractors on youtube, and it's night and day difference, although I haven't put my eye up to one, their recordings are amazing.

So when the time is right, and the minister is preoccupied elsewhere, I'll bring one home.

[NTSOG]

Damo 300: "So when the time is right, and the minister is preoccupied elsewhere, I'll bring one home."

What you need is a 'minister' who keeps a couple of horses and competes in equestrian events, the cost of said participation being so high that she dares not query any new tool or shooting toy I bring home.

[Damo300]

Damo 300: "So when the time is right, and the minister is preoccupied elsewhere, I'll bring one home."

What you need is a 'minister' who keeps a couple of horses and competes in equestrian events, the cost of said participation being so high that she dares not query any new tool or shooting toy I bring home.

Haha.
Funnily enough, the bloke I borrowed the thermal off is the exact man you mention above.....
To the T.