Prime Minister Abbott Said What Now

[Westy]

More than likely the truth and can you believe it the media got hold of it and twisted it again!!!
Who Would a thought!!!!!

Tony Abbott's choice of words on Indigenous communities clumsy, insensitive, destructive

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/ ... 415s9.html

AND HE HIT THE NAIL RIGHT ON THE f***ing HEAD!!!!!!!!!!

[Chronos]

but you can't just go about stating facts and spewing logic

it's the whole welfare system that's flawed, 30 years ago i lived in Murwillumbah on the tweed river, my mum worked at the then "employment office"

Every fortnight they'd come in from all corners, indigenous, hippies and the great communal unwashed to get their cheques, pay their accounts at the stores and blow the rest on grog and disappear for two weeks

I don't have a solution for this particular problem but surely if you "choose" to live a traditional "hunter gatherer" lifestyle as the PM says they surely you shouldn't need $1200/fortnight in dole and child support payments

Chronos

[coroboreeboy]

Personally, I don't believe Tony Abbot "hit the nail on the head" when he said that it was a lifestyle "choice". In my experience of aboriginal communities in the NT, it is rarely a choice, it is a lifestyle that they are stuck with.
By the way. "f....ing" doesn't add weight to your argument, rather it detracts from it. It betrays a lack of logical argument and a retreat to aggressive, meaningless gutter language.

[North East]

Hit the nail on the head.

[North East]

Abbots words were another nail in his coffin. I've got no time for the idiot.

[1290]

Not buying it 'coroboree' boy.... families survive in the 'burbs on welfare....regardless of their skin color, they pay the same $1 a litre for milk, 99c a loaf of bread and 7.99 a kilo for a leg of lamb..... the rest is personal choice - living in the suburbs of Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, A regional centre OR UNDER A TREE IN WOMBAT CREEK ..... that's not racism, that is reality....

The truth isnt always palatable to all...

[Mr.x]

Not buying it 'coroboree' boy.... families survive in the 'burbs on welfare....regardless of their skin color, they pay the same $1 a litre for milk, 99c a loaf of bread and 7.99 a kilo for a leg of lamb..... the rest is personal choice - living in the suburbs of Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, A regional centre OR UNDER A TREE IN WOMBAT CREEK ..... that's not racism, that is reality....

The truth isnt always palatable to all...

Cheers and well said mate!

I can't cop abbot but today was the first time I seen him grow a spine and tell it how it is.

[Warrigul]

Not buying it 'coroboree' boy.... families survive in the 'burbs on welfare....regardless of their skin color, they pay the same $1 a litre for milk, 99c a loaf of bread and 7.99 a kilo for a leg of lamb..... the rest is personal choice - living in the suburbs of Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, A regional centre OR UNDER A TREE IN WOMBAT CREEK ..... that's not racism, that is reality....

The truth isnt always palatable to all...

Someone who goes through the system and gets an education often does choose to become a dole bludger, they have the means and opportunity to better themselves but don't, what you have to realise is with some of the more remote communities things are a little more complicated than that. You don't often get the opportunity to go elsewhere or do something different.

Governments tried to fix this issue many years ago by taking children away, but as we all know that created another problem altogether.

Lumping it all in together is a bit simplistic.

[Oldbloke]

The public are able to read members comments. I feel sure they often form an opinion about all hunters/shooters based on just a few comments on forums such as this one. WE NEED THE GENERAL PUBLIC ON SIDE. Therefore a few comments by a few can effect the publics view of all hunters/shooters. May I suggest that everyone keep that in mind before hitting the submit button. Personnally I would prefer it if the general public did not think of me as being a bombastic, loud & foul mouthed perhaps even racist hunter, but rather a normal person who enjoys hunting, listens to and respects other peoples opinion, skin colour and religion.

[KWhorenet]

What's wrong with jumping on a bus or hitch hiking to go and pick fruit, do sheering shed work ? Its what people used to do when in need of work/cash, to get a good work reference and some life experience outside of a ******.

Instead our farmers have to employ tourists who WILL WORK for good coin !!

Life's too hard...can I have some more

[Westy]

What's wrong with jumping on a bus or hitch hiking to go and pick fruit, do sheering shed work ? Its what people used to do when in need of work/cash, to get a good work reference and some life experience outside of a ******.

Instead our farmers have to employ tourists who WILL WORK for good coin !!

Life's too hard...can I have some more

Amen Hornet!!!! My old man told me @ 14 there's a road going buy the house it'll take you anywhere you want it life
So Get on it!!!

And here I am!!!

Oldbloke-grow a set and Corobereboy if me dropping the F Bomb offends you I'm sorry, but the fact that my hard-earned goes to some bunch of bludgers living the life of Riley is making the taste of vomit form in the back of my throat as I type this!!!!

[Warrigul]

The public are able to read members comments. I feel sure they often form an opinion about all hunters/shooters based on just a few comments on forums such as this one. WE NEED THE GENERAL PUBLIC ON SIDE. Therefore a few comments by a few can effect the publics view of all hunters/shooters. May I suggest that everyone keep that in mind before hitting the submit button. Personnally I would prefer it if the general public did not think of me as being a bombastic, loud & foul mouthed perhaps even racist hunter, but rather a normal person who enjoys hunting, listens to and respects other peoples opinion, skin colour and religion.

You know what, this can sometimes be a problem whenever there is a gathering of people(not just shooters), I especially hate it when a person new to the sport has to be subjected to conspiracy theories about why our firearms were taken or that PA was a CIA plot etc etc. The odd racist bastard does tend to stand out as well when everyone else is trying to shoot and all is quiet and he has to gob on about blacks, dole bludgers etc etc. I can choose whom I have at a BBQ when I am running it but not a public club and it is downright embarassing at times to even be in the same shed as some of these outspoken racist turds. Sometimes it is better to take the opportunity, when it presents, to say nothing.

They are in the minority thank god.

Sometimes it doesn't hurt to take a step back and listen to what is being said with someone else's ears, everyone is entitled to express an opinion but often it is the same old washed out threadbare laundry that didn't wear well last week and is not going to improve with time.

[Jack V]

Some aboriginals are stuck in a place they don't want to be and others have created a life style they accept and promote.
To say a child has accepted a life style that is born into an outback mission and grows up there with parents that don't send them to school and allow them to be exposed to alcohol and drug problems is fairly stupid . The problem is that Tony Abbott is a typical jock he opens his mouth before his brain is in gear .
This statement is tantamount to saying that it's the child's fault that they are living in a bad situation .

[Bourt]

Lumping it all in together is a bit simplistic.

That's where he went wrong here IMO. Too broader statement, wrong context, whatever you want to call it.

By itself, the commend makes perfect sense. There are only 2 realistic options for living.

1) Live somewhere with work, earn a taxable income, rely on taxpayer funded government services.

2) If there is no work, limited access, limited population, then you need to be able to provide for yourself. Grow crops, dig for water, farm animals etc.

Trying to live in an area where you can earn nothing, grow nothing, farm nothing, not survive..... yet expect services to be flown into you at the great expense of others is a foolish expectation.

That's simple. Folding that into indigenous affairs and their history on the land etc. is complicated

The point is valid but was handled poorly in the way he just through the comment out there.

[Monty]

Guys,

No drama yet (a few border line) but consider this fair warning. If any comments get too derogatory here the thread is gone.

Keep it clean.

[coroboreeboy]

Oldbloke-grow a set and Corobereboy if me dropping the F Bomb offends you I'm sorry, but the fact that my hard-earned goes to some bunch of bludgers living the life of Riley is making the taste of vomit form in the back of my throat as I type this!

Westy, I fully agree with your feelings about people being on welfare for no reason other than that they are too lazy to work: I have in-laws who have been doing this literally for decades (not aboriginal by the way; 4th generation white Australians). But in this context we are talking about aboriginals living on remote communities, not Redfern or other city enclaves. I'm sure that if you were to spend a week or so at Mutitjulu or Imampa or Amata, then you would have to agree that in no way are these people "living the life of Riley". They are basically trapped in a "way of life" not a "lifestyle choice". This doesn't mean that they don't get enjoyment out of certain aspects of their lives, humans do that, no matter what their ethnicity or circumstances, but the fact remains that, generally speaking, people on remote aboriginal communities have next to no choice as to where they will live or what work they can access, in my experience.

[Oldbloke]

Warrigul, jack v, coroboreeboy, & monty, well said.

I understand only too well that people get emotional at times but a few manners and common sense cost nothing.

[Jack V]

Hands up how many people have ever visited any Aboriginal mission , or worked with any Aboriginals in any way ?
If you took a white child and brought them up in that same environment they would be exactly the same . It's partly our fault for allowing this situation to persist for so long by allowing aboriginals to be a separate race of Australians for too long . The very people in Aboriginal affairs that should be promoting sobriety , education and integration into modern Australian society are the very ones that keep them on the mission generation after generation because it's an industry for them and they don't want to loose their cushy jobs running the other peoples lives. They are not all like that and some do a good job I know one personally but many radicals and trouble makers still exist in the ranks . The idea that they can still live the indigenous life style in modern times is what is keeping them suffering . The true nomadic life style is way gone anyway so why not take the next step .
I can't even live the same life style my family had 60 years ago . There is too many cunning ones that victimise their own people by conning them that the white man hates them and to survive they have to cling to the old ways . It's total rubbish . You don't have to forget your roots or your culture to advance and be part of the modern age you just have to remember and cherish it but not allow it to stop you from advancing . It is working slowly , recently a record number of Aboriginal Doctors have graduated and that is a huge step forward as some of them will return to their homes to treat the locals and that is a great example to the younger generation .
Mr Abbott knows Jack s**t about Aboriginal issues and should keep his big mouth shut .

[on_one_wheel]

Yep he nailed it, there is nothing stopping them from cleaning themselves up and getting a job.

[Warrigul]

Yep he nailed it, there is nothing stopping them from cleaning themselves up and getting a job.

What you mean white people?

[coroboreeboy]

Yep he nailed it, there is nothing stopping them from cleaning themselves up and getting a job.

Do you really think that being illiterate doesn't stop you from getting a job?
It's hard enough for anyone without qualifications to get a job these days, let alone someone who can't read or write.
There are a lot of things stopping aboriginal people from "cleaning themselves up and getting a job".
The young ones might stand a chance if they can get off the community, find somewhere to live that they can afford while they're out of work, find their way through the maze of Centrelink unhelpfulness, but for adults, it is a lost cause.
Sorry mate, but trotting out tired old clichés like the above doesn't help.
Tony A's comments definitely don't help.
Actually, I don't think anything can help. It really is a lost cause. Some years ago, I thought that I could make a difference, I wasted a lot of time, money, emotion, trying to help.
Sorry mate, but it really is a complex issue, and one sentence statements like yours show a complete ignorance of the reality of the situation.
Don't mean to be insulting, this is not a personal attack, but you do not appear to have the faintest idea what you are talking about.

[anthillinside]

OK this is also not an attack on indigenous or any other group, it's my personal experience and view.
I came from a poverty stricken broken home so by definition I should be a drug addicted petty criminal constantly in and out of court living on the dole.
Minimal schooling, had to get out and earn money ASAP.
I didn’t get paid to go to school like the aboriginal kids at the end of the street.
We got no help from government or even charity organizations, we weren’t “Christian” enough and had a Germanic background so suffered our own type of discrimination.
Long story short I worked hard and improved my situation.
I’m better of now than my parent and most of the kids I grew up with.
I’m by no means rich and the future is still uncertain but I hope my kids will have an easier run, I know they have so far.
I’m still bitter about lots of things in the past, probably racist, sexist and any other tag you want to use.
I’ll still bitch about the rich, big business and government ripping us off, dole bludgers, un married mothers and other welfare cheats, I’ve never been on the dole and hope I never have to be.
But I have no sympathy for people who blame circumstances or others for their personal situation.
The tax payer provides for people who can’t provide for themselves as they should.
There is only one person who controls your life YOU.