Value of exciting shooter associations?

[juststarting]

I know this has been asked before but I thought I would do it again... The more I learn about our gun laws and circus that follows, the more I ask myself what is the point of SSAA or the Fishers and Shooters party. I may be completely wrong in saying this and I hope that it is my ignorance/lack of knowledge, but to me it seems like both are just toothless pointless associations/organizations that achieve nothing, not now nor in the past. Sure, I get some insurance cover, I have that through other means; and cheaper entry to shooting venues, though this is questionable when factoring in membership fees.

Anyway, the questions: what is it that they actually do; and more importantly, what have they achieved in a solid measurable kind of way in the last 5 years?

[Noisydad]

It's simple - if not for our shooters organisations neither you, nor anyone else would be shooting to day!

[juststarting]

So I keep hearing, but is it really the case? What is something measurable that has been done that supports that? So far I only see the opposite.

[sandgroperbill]

I suppose the more pertinent question is: do they do everything they can, or could they be doing more? This depends upon the organisation. As for the SSAA, I just can't justify dropping my hard earned on a membership. They are really really disappointing in my opinion.

Shooters union in queensland seem to do a good job and are proactive, however shooters union in WA is very poor, and seem to do virtually nothing except ride on the coat tails of their queensland counterparts.

In Victoria there is an alliance between the different groups and industry, and although I just can't remember the name right now, this to me seems the best way forward. They bought the different groups together and moved everyone in the same direction during the adler debate.

Different people will habe different opinions, and they are no less valid than mine or the next person, but this is just the way I see it.

[pomemax]

Spot on Noisy
SSAA membership for 5 years =$1.67 per week
range fee For non members i think is $24 not 100% on that, for members $22
at the SSAA shops you get 10% off (members discount in my case looking at what i have spent so far this membership cycle 2 years in is about $700 ) ammo and scopes count too other thing to factor into are the reloading components I get from them and they are the very shot term thing
As a run of the mill member of a really big organization what do they do we may never know, only way to find out would be to get involved .
I read reports from this bloke or that bloke that have had meeting with politicians and this is the outcome, could you sit there with Mr Shoebridge or Ms Samantha Lee i could not .
Go to the SSAA web page and do some reading of the state and federal level . Like most associations they can always do more personally I don't think they show what they do enough.

[juststarting]

That's kind of it, Pomemax. I would love to see more transparency and something quantifiable, if they have in fact achieved anything solid they would scream about it from roof tops. They would use it to generate momentum, this is how ‘marketing’ works. More exposure and publicity equates to broader acceptance and less demonisation. Instead, they write articles that are neither here nor there and send junkman once a month. First link I clicked - http://ssaavic.com.au/index.php/9-uncat ... -transport - this article alone creates more hysteria than the actual changes. Who reviews these sh*t?!

Noisydad has an interesting point, "if not for our shooters organisations neither you, nor anyone else would be shooting” - sure… I neither agree nor disagree. As a shooter I would like agree, but I need to know what that means? Since '96 gun laws only got stricter. And while on the subject - Adler (I decided I want one). That was all on Liberal Democrats and I suspect only because the senator likes the gun (Liberal Democrats = Libertarians = narcissists, read some of their policies). Nobody moved in any direction accept for writing lame letters that just get swept under the carpet, laughed at and ignored (this is how I feel). Nothing is for nothing, especially with Libertarians and Liberal Democrats for reasons unknown - though I suspect the senator simply liked the gun and couldn’t care less about the immigration bill... . And before we jumped into backroom deals conspiracy theory - no shooter organisation has anything to trade to orchestrate a deal like that with LDP. So, perhaps everyone moved in the same direction, but whether that movement was representative of any sort of displacement in regards to actual importation or not is a completely different conversation.

I am a paying member, so I am interested what are they doing for our rights? It’s a reasonably simple question, I thought.

Sandgroperbill, thanks - if you remember the details about Victoria, please post.

[Strikey]

I know this has been asked before but I thought I would do it again... The more I learn about our gun laws and circus that follows, the more I ask myself what is the point of SSAA or the Fishers and Shooters party. I may be completely wrong in saying this and I hope that it is my ignorance/lack of knowledge, but to me it seems like both are just toothless pointless associations/organizations that achieve nothing, not now nor in the past. Sure, I get some insurance cover, I have that through other means; and cheaper entry to shooting venues, though this is questionable when factoring in membership fees.

Anyway, the questions: what is it that they actually do; and more importantly, what have they achieved in a solid measurable kind of way in the last 5 years?

My way of thinking was a bit like yours before I joined the SSAA some 20 odd years ago, I don't like to get involved with the politics but I enjoy shooting. I have been involved in a lot of different competitions that satisfy my competitive streak, have made many friends with a common interest across this country, we have some world class ranges to shoot at that have also produced world champions in various disciplines. I am happy to pay my son's and my membership each year because what we get out of it I think is value for our money

[Noisydad]

I can tell you from personal experience over an eight year period fighting big nose Levy in the duck swamps that duck shooting would have been long gone. Field and Game Aust. Is solely responsible for that prick being banned from our swamps for six months. That fight started in 1988.

[sandgroperbill]

Sandgroperbill, thanks - if you remember the details about Victoria, please post.

Here ya go:
http://www.firearmscouncil.org.au/index ... in-review/

I think there's still plenty of room for improvement, but something like this at a national level lobbying at both state and federal level is the way forward.

[Chronos]

Any and all of those organisations are only as strong as their members, want them to do more? get involved and help out. same goes for your local range too

Chronos

[tom604]

shooters and fishers,ssaa,shooters union all do their bit,,can/could they do more?? maybe, maybe not, but if they were not there what would the shooting scene be like?
pta's of over six months? fees up more than they are already? i would say that it would be a lot worse than it is and if they haven't made it better, they at least have stopped it getting worse. jmho

[Baronvonrort]

I think the big problem with Shooters and fishers party is inexperience with politics, Leyonhjelm from the LDP has been around for a while,he started in Labor then went to Liberal he quit them after having to hand in his AR15 and FN FAL in 1996.

I think the SSAA and other groups are improving a little, the SSAA put out a guide for the media outlining facts from fiction recently.
Back in 1996 the SSAA was run by shooting enthusiasts today they need someone with a political science degree.

[Oldbloke]

"Back in 1996 the SSAA was run by shooting enthusiasts today they need someone with a political science degree." Bloody good point. Hard to keep up with it nowadays. They probably need to work more with the political parties and the media, of all types and persuasions.
I have been a member for perhaps 35 yrs and intend staying one. Why, well I don't need to go to their ranges or the magazine. I pay for the insurance & to help them with funds to help us. Are they great at it, perhaps not but who else is there? I just figure I'm doing my bit. We should all be a member of ssaa or another organisation or political party. If we are not members we are not entitled to winge when they "are coming to take them away ha ha " . Join up or shut up.

[juststarting]

Oldbloke, I am a member :p your response is pretty much what my motivations are, right now. Be good to see them a lot more active in the media though. I think this is the right time for it. I only wonder what would happen if all shooters voted 'right' - what would happen.

[Oldbloke]

Sorry, the join up or shut up bit was not directed at an yone in particular. I meant it to be a genearisation.

[juststarting]

And so the rant begins! http://myshootingjourney.com/2015/12/29 ... was-wrong/

[happyhunter]

And so the rant begins! http://myshootingjourney.com/2015/12/29 ... was-wrong/

Read your blog post. What type of gun control are you supporting by the statement that some gun control should exist? IMO anybody with a mental health issue or past mental health issue should not by any means be able to purchase a gun, but beyond that I can't see any need for gun control be that licensing or registration.

[happyhunter]

I know this has been asked before but I thought I would do it again... The more I learn about our gun laws and circus that follows, the more I ask myself what is the point of SSAA or the Fishers and Shooters party. I may be completely wrong in saying this and I hope that it is my ignorance/lack of knowledge, but to me it seems like both are just toothless pointless associations/organizations that achieve nothing, not now nor in the past. Sure, I get some insurance cover, I have that through other means; and cheaper entry to shooting venues, though this is questionable when factoring in membership fees.

Anyway, the questions: what is it that they actually do; and more importantly, what have they achieved in a solid measurable kind of way in the last 5 years?

The value is relative to your experience with them. I change address a lot, and needing some vehicle repairs lead to a conversation with the mechanic ( I had just moved to a new town in a new state) and it turned out he was a hunter and an active member of F&G. That day I was invited on a fox drive organised by the F&G members for that weekend. So less than 2 days after the move I was already connected to other hunters and had property access.

That is the value in shooter orgainisations.

[juststarting]

IMO anybody with a mental health issue or past mental health issue should not by any means be able to purchase a gun, but beyond that I can't see any need for gun control be that licensing or registration.

Perhaps I phrased it incorrectly. How about storage requirements and type?

[happyhunter]

IMO anybody with a mental health issue or past mental health issue should not by any means be able to purchase a gun, but beyond that I can't see any need for gun control be that licensing or registration.

Perhaps I phrased it incorrectly. How about storage requirements and type?

Not sure what you are asking in regard to stroage and type but I will make an assumption you mean having to lock guns up by law and banning certain types of guns is a good idea? Nothing wrong with locking up your valuable property, although some of the storage rules are nonsense. Most gun safes are useless and the locks can be picked in minutes. Having cops come inspect your property without a warrant is an anti-democratic invasion of privacy and sets a bad precedent against the rights of the individual against the might of the state.

Banning certain types of guns makes no sense. It just provides a false sense of security. If you qualified for a CAT D licence you can buy a AR15 from a gun dealer or for the same price your neighborhood ice dealer can buy a Type 56 on the black market, or very easily a black market self loader in QLD which is still awash with surplus SKS rifles from the Sir Jo days. Banning certain types of firearms is pointless because it doesn't stop supply.

Now will the first forum member who as a LAFO thinks it's right that they shouldn't be allowed to own an SKS, AR, AK etc.. put up their hand because you are the problem.

[juststarting]

I feel like I can play a pretty devastating devils advocate here, so I am going to stfu and go back to my coffee. Probably for the best.

[headspace]

I reckon the SSAA does a fair bit, in fact at the moment, just holding our ground is pretty good considering the negativity and misrepresentation coming from the anti gun mob, especially the greens (lower case on purpose). A lot of people tend to sit back and winge but don't get involved. The SSAA may not be perfect, but who is? between them and the Shooters and Fishers Party I believe some good things have been accomplished.
Some of the crap that comes out in this forum wanting things like concealed carry is ridiculous. We never had it and we are not likely too. Get behind the organisations that ARE doing something and don't white ant from the sidelines.

[dhv]

The SSAA may not be perfect, but who is? between them and the Shooters and Fishers Party I believe some good things have been accomplished.
.

Can you name 3 recent positive achievements please?

They aren't even on speaking terms in NSW mate.

[headspace]

The SSAA may not be perfect, but who is? between them and the Shooters and Fishers Party I believe some good things have been accomplished.
.

Can you name 3 recent positive achievements please?

They aren't even on speaking terms in NSW mate.

For a start, you still have your guns don't you? Sure things could be better, that's always going be the case but unless some of you blokes have got something useful to contribute, why sit around and grizzle on a forum. If you care that much get involved, write your local member State and Federal, unless of course thay happen to be Greens. Then get involved with your preferred Hunting and shooting organisation. Talk is bloody cheap.

[Sam45]

QLD awash with semi auto SKS rifles Bwahahahahahaha, your a comedian happyhunter

[Heckler303]

QLD awash with semi auto SKS rifles Bwahahahahahaha, your a comedian happyhunter

Even if QLD was I still wouldn't touch one with a ten foot pole.


What about the M1 Carbines and SLR's that would still be hanging about?

[MalleeFarmer]

I'm just now for the first time a member of SSAA. But unfortunately not able to get involved with a club in any way but I would love to just almost 2h in any direction to get to one.

[Korkt]

I am going to stfu and go back to my coffee

I often share that philosophy

[headspace]

Not everyone can be actively involved in the club of their choice, but lobbying MP's is one way to "keep the bastards honest". Pollies respond to the loudest noise so if they think there's more votes in banning guns, that most likely what they'll do. If they think they will lose a lot of votes by that they'll change their mind. Any letter you write must be polite and sensible. Sending an email about how you want concealed carry or other nonsense will just make you look like a tosser, and ingrain it even more firmly in their mind everything the anti's say. If you can't write a decent letter, it's probably better to remain silent.

[happyhunter]

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