Accurate .22 Pistol

[Boo]

Nearly completed the licence process but I have little idea on what pistol to get for target shooting, the blokes in the club are helpful but I don't like or want to start off with a specialist heavy target pistol. Honestly I'd prefer a light polymer frame job like a S&W M&P Compact but it's short barrel alone indicates that it may not be accurate enough. The only 'proper' target pistol that may suit is the Beretta 87, the more upright grip looks good but I have not handled one yet. There is also the Walther P22Q Target but it's partly made of monkey metal which is disappointing.

So, any pistoleers here able to help? Particularly concerning the accuracy of the polymer framed ones. Thanks, I will have to keep the first one for a year so it's important that it handles nicely and is accurate enough for a newby

[Wylie27]

What matches do you intend to shoot?

[Boo]

Club mainly runs CF 50m but action is of interest too.

[brett1868]

Are you forced to have a 22 as a first pistol in the Banana Republic? The 22 isn't much good at 50m and they're pretty low on action. Best advice, don't buy the Ruger and of the Beretta, Browning Buckmark, S&W they are pretty much on par. Once you licensed to handle a pistol go check out a few matches and see what others are using, see if you can get a few shots of different 22's and go from there.
I have a Beretta 87 Target and a Ruger MkIII Competition, both are good but I tend to shoot the Berretta most because it feels more comfortable in my hand and the Ruger is a pain to clean. A friend has the Buckmark and I quite like the feel of it as well and just like most 22's you'll need to try several different brands / types of ammo to see which the pistol prefers.

[Boo]

Prefer to start with a .22, I've just noticed the discontinued S&W 422 which is very light but I'm not sure if the underslung barrel setup would suit and how accurate they are. Anyone used one? Would prefer something new but light target capable pistols seem to be light on the ground. Pun

[Wylie27]

Sounds like Youare looking for looking for an all you can eat 22.

They don't really exist.. as Brett said the target 87, Buckmark or the S&w victory...

I have a walther ppq in 22... it's good, accurateish.. not a Hamerli 208 accurate though.

[GLS_1956]

Browning's Buckmarks are good pistols, so are Rugers semis, I have both My Buckmark is an early one and my Ruger is the discontinued Government Target model. The Browning has a holster, the Ruger has a carrying case. I have other 22 handguns as well, but I've not shot them as much as these two.

My Colt, made by Walther in Germany, 22-45 Rail Gun has functioned reliably with all I've fed it so far, but that is only a few hundred rounds, and I've not sat down and really shot if for the accuracy test. The Stoeger Luger I bought 40+ years ago hasn't been shot it probably 25 years but it ate a lot of ammo when I was shooting it.

I've few I inherited from my father which have yet to make it to the range.

[Gun-nut]

Most important is what fits in your hand that's under your budget. Most major manufacturers have some lineup of .22 handguns so it's best you search around your LGS, find something you like and research heavily into it to see if it fits your criteria.

[brett1868]

Another option.....buy a 1911 framed 22LR that can then be upgraded to centre fire with a new slide / mag kit. I have a Kimber 1911 10mm and today I scored a 22LR conversion kit at a good price. 1 frame, 2 choices of caliber so practise on the 22LR and when you're ready swap over to centre fire with little or no learning curve.

[pomemax]

All the pistols I own are more accurate than I am

[brett1868]

All the pistols I own are more accurate than I am

Good chatting to you last Saturday and I'll try and find you again this Saturday if I get time to shoot, always a pleasure catching up face to face with forum members.

[Wylie27]

Wish I could have got there on Saturday.. I gave up after being in traffic for two hours..

I got to north ryde and just turned home.. was not happy. 3 accidents happened in front of me whilst I was stuck traffic going no where.

[pomemax]

Where were you coming from .

[brett1868]

Wish I could have got there on Saturday.. I gave up after being in traffic for two hours..

I got to north ryde and just turned home.. was not happy. 3 accidents happened in front of me whilst I was stuck traffic going no where.

Move down Campbelltown way....you can shoot and drive at the same time

[Wylie27]

Pomemax.. northern beaches. Collaroy... I left home drove into a traffic jam 2 accidents.. that's when I should have gone home.

Lol I used to live near Liverpool Brett.. yeah loved that life lol

[GLS_1956]

A little update to my posting from a few days back. I got out to the range on Sunday with a few of the guns I inherited from my father, in the batch was a S&W 422 with a 6 inch barrel, adjustable sights.

What I can I tell you about it, after about 50 rounds, is this. It is light in weight compared to my Buckmark, but not excessively so. The "controls" are a bit different but not drastically so, the slide release is back next to the manual safety and the magazine release is positioned in the middle of the pistol grip's fore strap, the magazine holds 10 rounds The adjustable sight give a clear sight picture and the trigger while not the equal to my Ruger Gov't Target or Competition Models is acceptable.

Now when I shot the gun I was using Winchester's bulk packed high velocity 38 gr lead hollow point ammunition, my distance was about 30 to 40 feet away from the target and I was firing from a sitting position without the use of a rest of any type. I'm 60 years old and my optometrist tells me my eyes are no longer correctable to 20/20. So taking all those factors into consideration I was happy with the 5 inch, with most shots hitting inside of 4 inches, groups I got. The low set barrel looks odd during loading but I think it's low setting does help mitigate recoil.

[Boo]

Thanks for that GLS_1956, now it would be very useful if you compared the accuracy and general target ability of the 422 with your other .22's, just your feel and opinion. You sound like you've put a few through some barrels so what you think would certainly count.

[Boo]

Have pretty well boiled my choice down to between two 5" barrel Walthers, the PPQ M2 and the P22Q. Would have preferred an American poly using bits made of proper metal but all their barrels are too short and I have no confidence in the accuracy of the longer light PacSol barrels for the Buck Mark and various Rugers, all the solid metal ones are too heavy except the old S&W 422 which I'm reluctantly disregarding due to questionable parts availability. With just one gun for 12 months I don't want to be stuck waiting for parts.

So it will likely be the lighter and cheaper P22Q unless the PPQ is more accurate.

[Wylie27]

Hey Boo where are you located again?

If near Sydney, I have the PPQ M2 .22 competition you can try out..

[Boo]

Nowhere near Sydney unfortunately Wylie27, thankyou for your kind offer though. Yours is the one I think I'll get, how do you find the accuracy, good enough for a newbie one handed at 25 and 50 meters?

[Wylie27]

It's accurate.. it's not a hamerli or anything like that.. particularly at 25.

It is about as accurate as my ruger mk3 was

[Boo]

That will do me then.

[Boo]

To be a bit sensible the Beretta 87 Target and the Hammerli E-esse have been included in the short list together with the Walther PPQ .22. The Beretta has a bad trigger reputation, the E-esse has occasional operating problems while the Walther seems almost, err, bullet proof. Any experiences with any of these are welcome, I understand that the Walther will not be quite as accurate as the other two but seeing that the choice will be my only gun for a year reliability and fun are important.

[brett1868]

To be a bit sensible the Beretta 87 Target and the Hammerli E-esse have been included in the short list together with the Walther PPQ .22. The Beretta has a bad trigger reputation, the E-esse has occasional operating problems while the Walther seems almost, err, bullet proof. Any experiences with any of these are welcome, I understand that the Walther will not be quite as accurate as the other two but seeing that the choice will be my only gun for a year reliability and fun are important.

What have you heard about the Beretta Triggers? The one I have seems good so far, a little on the heavy side for my liking but beaks crisp and consistent. I'll do some Googling on improving the Beretta trigger as I'd like it a bit lighter. I'm yet to try the 22LR Conversion on my Kimber to see how it compares, will test it tomorrow night as I like the idea of dual purpose firearms

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[Boo]

Americans say that the 87's trigger pull is long and vague basically and the only real fix is to substitute the trigger from another model. Emailed Beretta today asking them had the 87's trigger design been changed recently, this complaint has been going on for years now so it does seem that there is some sort of substance to it. I like the idea of the Beretta but the trigger question does have me concerned.

[brett1868]

Americans say that the 87's trigger pull is long and vague basically and the only real fix is to substitute the trigger from another model. Emailed Beretta today asking them had the 87's trigger design been changed recently, this complaint has been going on for years now so it does seem that there is some sort of substance to it. I like the idea of the Beretta but the trigger question does have me concerned.

I did some reading and there's plenty on the trigger having too much creep and over travel. I wasn't conscious of this till you raised it so I'll keep this in mind when I shoot tomorrow night though it doesn't seem to detract from my scores at this stage.

[Boo]

Sorry to have mentioned it in the first place Brett, now you will be conscious of it. Hope you are still happy with it, let us know.

[Spudman75]

Check out the S&W Model 41, beautiful.

[brett1868]

Shot Rimfire Silhouette tonight at St Mary's with he Beretta 87 and managed to top score (23) 2nd comp in a row and beat my previous best of 19. I headed over to range B after the comp to shoot some 460 reloads I'm working on, Some 10mm as well before slapping the 22LR conversion onto the Kimber 1911. First rounds were painful, wouldn't eject or stovepiped using Lapua Centre X LRN std velocity ammo which shoots very well in the Beretta. A quick trip to the counter "Gimme a box of the hottest fasterest 22LR you have please", "CCI Stinger" in hand the problem was gone, perfect cycling and surprisingly good accuracy though only tested at 10m. As a FYI this ammo is much louder then I'd expect from a 22LR cartridge. If I can find a round equally as "Hot" in LRN I'll have a go next comp and see if I can beat the Beretta's performance.

P.S. I was too focused on smashing the bloody chickens I forgot to study the trigger feel...

10 @ 10m Kimber 1911 with 22LR Conversion Kit

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A little tweaking of seating depth, crimp should tighten this group a bit more. Very happy with this load, shot better then most of the guys did with their rifles tonight.

5 @ 50m 460XVR

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[Boo]

That's good result from the Beretta Brett, nice work.

On the PPQ M2, through a lot of research a little bit of info on the inherent accuracy of the 5"er is coming through, unfortunately for all the 'reviews' made virtually none address this important issue, most involve someone banging away at various targets using various makes of ammo with no attempt at any objective accuracy test. Basically I've decided to compare the X-esse and the 87 with the PPQ on the assumption that if the PPQ is behind on accuracy then it won't be by much. Beretta have basically told me that the 87 is named as a target pistol because of it's barrel length and if I want a better trigger then I'll have to go to a purpose made target gun. That's something I don't accept.