Howa 7.62 x 39

[Hugh]

I recently purchased a Howa 7.62 x 39 as a few years ago I had a heart attack and before Xmas I had a cardiac arrest which involved fitting a defibrillater in to my chest so I was something that had light recoil so it wouldn't upset it.I wanted something that I could use to still shoot deer and was reasonably accurate out to 100 yards.I hadn't shot since my heart attack[5y] but on a recent trip to AK some friendly locals took me bear hunting,wanted me to go out before hand and show that I could shoot,but I realized I couldn't risk it in a another country for first time [pity they also had a machine gun]no probs they said and shoved a SW stainless 5 shot revolver in 454 cassul in my hand ,your on backup.This trip got my interest back into shooting and after some research I narrowed it down to [ to leveraction in 44mag or 454 cassul or 30/30]but had to drop the 30/30 as it still was a bit high in recoil,then looking around gun shops I was shown a Cz in 7.62 x35 and thought that is the calibre for me as it was lower in recoil than the 44 but still had reasonable ballistics .Anyway found a Howa 7.62 x39 at a good price its the heavy barrelled model[all the better for me]and put a Kahles helia super [1966 vin] on it.On the range to 200 yards it will shoot better than I can and I can put 40 rounds though it in a session without feeling a thing a real fun gun to shoot and easy on the pocket,fits like a carbine wish I had tried lighter rounds years earlier.

[in2anity]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

[Gun-nut]

That's the great thing about shooting, no matter what condition you have or what circumstances you're under, there's always a rifle out there to suit your needs.

[Hugh]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

[Hugh]

That's the great thing about shooting, no matter what condition you have or what circumstances you're under, there's always a rifle out there to suit your needs.

Yes my previous high calibre rifles were a Howa 30.06[which had good kick] and 444 Marlin which had more of a shove than a kick.

[in2anity]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

[Hugh]

I don't reload but would of looked at the blk if it was available in the howa.The 308 projectiles have a much wider range of bullets and its the latest new thing on the block.Factory loaded ammo is available up to 154 gr for the7.62 x 39 but mostly you have to order them.

[scotty87]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

Have you considered the ruger American ranch in 300blk, pretty sure it's available in that calibre.

[Oldbloke]

Cheaper to keep the 30-06 and buy a Lee reloader kit. But I guess you had sold the 30-06.
I would have got a 308 and light loaded it. But that's me.

[in2anity]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

Have you considered the ruger American ranch in 300blk, pretty sure it's available in that calibre.

Yeah I've been tempted - but I'm just gonna get a short, bull-barrel 308 next and I'll just load it down. A lot more versatile that way. IMO if you roll your own, the 300blk is really for tac-tards; nothing you can't do with a tight twist 308 shooting reduced loads.

[scotty87]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

Have you considered the ruger American ranch in 300blk, pretty sure it's available in that calibre.

Yeah I've been tempted - but I'm just gonna get a short, bull-barrel 308 next and I'll just load it down. A lot more versatile that way. IMO if you roll your own, the 300blk is really for tac-tards; nothing you can't do with a tight twist 308 shooting reduced loads.

Yeah I load the Sierra 135gr HP in my howa .308 sporter currently, just bought 500 more of them so tempted by the blackout still, less recoil and less powder usage, the riverman OAF platform would be perfect for it but I wouldn't be allowed to use it to hunt in NSW and would be a pain to use at single round only ranges in Brisbane.

[Mr.Seacucumber]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

The Howa 7.62x39 has a .311" barrel and uses those readily available projectiles. You can buy them bulk fairly easily in Australia.

[in2anity]

The Howa 7.62x39 has a .311" barrel and uses those readily available projectiles. You can buy them bulk fairly easily in Australia.

Yep but not as nearly as much choice as .308" - I can get 500 cast lead .308 165gn Round Nose Flat Point HRBCs for less than $100. Admittedly I can also get 180gn .31" Flat Points, but I'm not sure a 7.62x39 rifle will stabilise the long 303 projectile...

[Mr.Seacucumber]

The Howa 7.62x39 has a .311" barrel and uses those readily available projectiles. You can buy them bulk fairly easily in Australia.

Yep but not as nearly as much choice as .308" - I can get 500 cast lead .308 165gn Round Nose Flat Point HRBCs for less than $100. Admittedly I can also get 180gn .31" Flat Points, but I'm not sure a 7.62x39 rifle will stabilise the long 303 projectile...

And you can get 500 of these for $120

https://www.thebarn.net.au/Products/00170+Berrys+7.62X39+123gr+Spire+Point+(250)/44833?ReturnURL=%2fcategories%2fProjectiles%2f41%3fCategory%3d41%26brand%3dAll%26keywords%3d%26sort%3dProductTitle+ASC%26pageno%3d1

Sure the .308 has more choice but I personally wouldn't compare the two. 7.62x39 excels at ranges out to 300m where 308 is much further then that, however 308 has more recoil and that's the reason the misses choose the mini action of a 308.

Also if you have the cash you can import bulk surplas ammo from the states for under 50 cents a round but you need to buy a few crates.

[in2anity]

And you can get 500 of these for $120

https://www.thebarn.net.au/Products/001 ... Point+(250)/44833?ReturnURL=%2fcategories%2fProjectiles%2f41%3fCategory%3d41%26brand%3dAll%26keywords%3d%26sort%3dProductTitle+ASC%26pageno%3d1

Funny you mention that; was literally just thinking the counter to my argument would be the Berry's projectile Yeah agreed the Berry's are pretty darn good value. Still not as cheap as plinking lead, but agreed, not much $$ in it.

7.62x39 excels at ranges out to 300m where 308 is much further then that, however 308 has more recoil and that's the reason the misses choose the mini action of a 308.

What's stopping you just loading down the 308 (and shooting a lighter projectile)? Do you have concerns about powder positioning inconsistencies?

Also if you have the cash you can import bulk surplas ammo from the states for under 50 cents a round but you need to buy a few crates.

How does one go about doing this exactly? Would you do it through a supplier? Any legal/licensing requirements?

[Mitch]

Wait, 7.62x35(aka 300blk)? Or do you mean 7.62x39(Russian)?

Yes 7.62 x 39

Sorry, wasn't trying to be a smart arse. I'm actually praying or 300blk in Howa MA because the main problem with 7.62x39 is projectile availability. Gone are the days of being able to buy cheap, bulk milsurp ammo; it's way overpriced now. And you don't have a lot of options when it comes to .312" projectiles. Sure there's a few options, but nothing super cheap. 300blk on the other hand - it's designed for .308" projectiles, so obviously way more projectile options (therefore ultimately significantly cheaper to run).

I'm still waiting for someone to test a 180gr .303 through your rifle (and also the CZ527 and Ruger American Ranch 7.62x39) - if any of those group 303 projectiles as good as anything then it's a real possibility to run 303 cast lead (and thus is a good choice of rifle for me considering I'm such a poor arse ).

Have you considered the ruger American ranch in 300blk, pretty sure it's available in that calibre.

Yeah I've been tempted - but I'm just gonna get a short, bull-barrel 308 next and I'll just load it down. A lot more versatile that way. IMO if you roll your own, the 300blk is really for tac-tards; nothing you can't do with a tight twist 308 shooting reduced loads.

I am one of your so called "tac-tards".

The 300BLK does a great job for certain things. I didnt buy mine for the military background etc.

I can only think of one 308 with a 16" barrel from factory.
Can't think of any with as tight twist as required for heavy stuff

I love mine, there is nothin tac about it and i hate all the tactical crap people buy and use these days.

It is very similar to 30/30 usage but with better projectile choice from 90-230gn projectiles. It may not be what everyone likes but it has a place.

[in2anity]

I am one of your so called "tac-tards".

The 300BLK does a great job for certain things. I didnt buy mine for the military background etc.

I can only think of one 308 with a 16" barrel from factory.
Can't think of any with as tight twist as required for heavy stuff

I love mine, there is nothin tac about it and i hate all the tactical crap people buy and use these days.

It is very similar to 30/30 usage but with better projectile choice from 90-230gn projectiles. It may not be what everyone likes but it has a place.

No offence intended mate yes the 300blk generally has a tighter twist (to handle the 220gn), but so long as you stay down under 200gn for the 308 there's literally nothing the 300blk can do that 308 can't. If you don't reload on the other hand, I can definitely see the appeal for 300blk; basically an intermediate 30 cal with reduced recoil, good for heavy subs. Understand that I'm not arguing against this and i can see it's place in the world - but you can just cook these yourself for the 308 (if you reload). FYI the Remington 700 16.5" has a 1:10 so fairly tight for a 308.

[in2anity]

The Remington 700 with a 16.5 shooting a 180gr + at full speed would kick like a mule. But if close range combat was the plan no one is getting up after being hit. It would be a 1.5-2 moa gun i would think.

Yeah it sure would - you definitely would not plink with full power loads What makes you think it wouldn't be a sub-moa rifle Sungazer? (considering the heavy bull barrel, with the right load I would have expected much tighter than that, more like the 0.5 - 0.75moa mark)

For example:

https://rifleshooter.com/2013/11/super- ... ion-rifle/

https://www.ar15.com/forums/precision-rifles/-/3-597/

Time will tell as It's on my bucket list.

[in2anity]

Just based on my Remington 700 SPS with the 24 inch Varmint barrel. It was about 1 -1.5 moa at best. The chambers are Factory read big and sloppy. The shorter barrel IMHO will limit the accuracy at longer ranges Ok out to about 300m probably.

In terms of accuracy, the only difference should be the shorter barrel will wipe a little bit of velocity off, so yes for F-class style applications it wouldn't be as effective. But < 500m accuracy should be pretty similar, albeit a bit more of a rainbow. Oh and of course it'll be less pleasant to shoot due to increased recoil But I hardly ever shoot max loads mainly due to the fact that you simply can't with cast-lead projectiles, and most of the time there's no point.

[Gaz52]

I cast 180 gn .314" lead bullets from a Cast bullet engineering mould in my Baikal break action 7.62x39. The flat point gas checked bullet stabilizes even with reduced loads in the little Russian . Check out CBE's web site .

[bladeracer]

Yeah I've been tempted - but I'm just gonna get a short, bull-barrel 308 next and I'll just load it down. A lot more versatile that way. IMO if you roll your own, the 300blk is really for tac-tards; nothing you can't do with a tight twist 308 shooting reduced loads.

The 300BLK does have some advantages over reduced loads in .308, and that's the twist rate which lets you shoot up to 300gn bullets, maybe even heavier than that?
If you can get a .308 with 7"-twist then you can shoot everything the BLK can.
But I'm with you, .308 loaded down is more versatile. If I need to sling a 300gn bullet at 1500fps I'll use something that does that job - 45/70, 450 Bushmaster, .458 SOCOM, or even .44 Magnum.

I'll probably still get a 300BLK just for giggles though

[in2anity]

The 300BLK does have some advantages over reduced loads in .308, and that's the twist rate which lets you shoot up to 300gn bullets, maybe even heavier than that?

Really? Do you reckon a 1:7 would handle a 300gn+ pill? That'd be sick if it could! Almost light 45/70 territory!

[bladeracer]

The 300BLK does have some advantages over reduced loads in .308, and that's the twist rate which lets you shoot up to 300gn bullets, maybe even heavier than that?

Really? Do you reckon a 1:7 would handle a 300gn+ pill? That'd be sick if it could! Almost light 45/70 territory!

I'm not that familiar with it but I have seen threads with people trying to find the limits of what they can push out of the BLK. I think it's been pushed well above 300gn but I'm not sure if anybody has found a limit. The main problem is getting enough powder into the case to push the bullet to the end of the barrel

[bladeracer]

https://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/300-aac-blackout-caliber/#axzz4rlEukwhj

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=80334

[Hugh]

Ok everybody is missing point here,i needed not just lighter recoil but light recoil and the 7.62x 39 on chuck hawks recoil table was about 6lbs a lot less than the 30/30,also needed something that was legal on deer.I believe the 300 blk would also have done the job.

[bladeracer]

Ok everybody is missing point here,i needed not just lighter recoil but light recoil and the 7.62x 39 on chuck hawks recoil table was about 6lbs a lot less than the 30/30,also needed something that was legal on deer.I believe the 300 blk would also have done the job.

Can you have a shoot with a .308 with a muzzle brake maybe?
For deer you're only likely to be taking one shot so a brake should be tolerable for that.
When you want to shoot smaller stuff load down accordingly.

[in2anity]

Ok everybody is missing point here,i needed not just lighter recoil but light recoil and the 7.62x 39 on chuck hawks recoil table was about 6lbs a lot less than the 30/30,also needed something that was legal on deer.I believe the 300 blk would also have done the job.

Oops yeah sorry mate. Nah the 7.62x39 is a great little intermediate cartridge; you've done well. I'm starting to see the "Howa" light I think; all things considered it's hard to beat!

[Hugh]

Ok everybody is missing point here,i needed not just lighter recoil but light recoil and the 7.62x 39 on chuck hawks recoil table was about 6lbs a lot less than the 30/30,also needed something that was legal on deer.I believe the 300 blk would also have done the job.

Can you have a shoot with a .308 with a muzzle brake maybe?
For deer you're only likely to be taking one shot so a brake should be tolerable for that.
When you want to shoot smaller stuff load down accordingly.

It only takes the one shot to find out and if its no good I will have to walk for a month plus more visits to docs,I have been able shot 30 plus rounds at the range with this calibre with no ill effect.

[Gamerancher]

"What we have here is a failure to communicate", I believe that's from a movie. ( Cool Hand Luke for you young'uns )
You blokes need to read the O.P. "I recently purchased a Howa 7.62 x 39"
Suggesting that Hugh buy this or try that is a bit late.
He bought a Howa - tick.
It is chambered in 7.62 x 39 - tick.
Arguing over this is better than that,or what he should have done instead is a bit redundant.

[Gwion]

^^^
Yup.

I take it Hugh will only be targeting smaller deer species inside 100yd?

I'm not familiar with the 39 but from the paper figures it would be pretty light on for larger deer. According to ballisticstudies.com, it can be a slow and unreliable killing cartridge if not kept within strict limitations.

EDITED because website referred to was incorrect. Correct address now.